TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Discuss your favourite cars, racing or non-racing
User avatar
TheStig
NFSUnlimited Staff
NFSUnlimited Staff
Posts: 8740
Joined: 30 Jan 2004, 02:40
Location: The Netherlands

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by TheStig »

What I seen from the pictures the parts are OEM Toyota parts (TRD is just racing/sports parts remember)

But other than that I have nothing else to say then what Bogan said
Image
User avatar
Andre_online
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 7730
Joined: 04 Jun 2004, 10:43
Location: Singapore (GMT+8)
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Andre_online »

OK, this might sound a little (or very) noobish, mainly because I have yet to earn my permit. But I really need to know this, for the benefit of my Dad.

So, our family car is a 1997 Toyota Land Cruiser/Lexus LX470, and we got it from a second hand dealership some two years ago. So, the car is in automatic gearbox. The question I have is, would sticking the gear in "N" be any different from sticking it in "P" when it's parked? The reason he does that is because he's been driving cars on stick shifts for the past 3 decades, and it makes perfect sense for him to stick it to "N", since that's what we'd do if we had a manual transmission car. So, if there is/are any difference(s), I'd love to know of them, 'cuz I've been telling my Dad not to have the habit of sticking it to "N" when the car is parked, and I have told him off and on to stick it to "P" instead. Not that I can tell the difference from what I can see, seeing the car is stagnant. Should there be any difference, I'd wanna inform my Dad about it and why he should indeed have the habit of sticking it to "P". :)

And one final question. There's also an "L" word at the most bottom of the gear. I'm assuming that's to engage first gear, or a lower gear for slopes?

Thanks!
Last edited by Andre_online on 25 Feb 2010, 08:03, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
PSZeTa
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 4123
Joined: 07 Feb 2004, 19:26
Location: 30-12-1900

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by PSZeTa »

You can leave it in N if you have a seperate handbrake. Putting it in P locks the wheels, but it should still be used with a handbrake.

L is probably low gear, yes.
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

That's right, P locks the transmission so the car can't move. You should definitely use it when parking, especially on a large car that has lots of weight. Even in a manual car you should put it into gear when parking.

More importantly, he should should avoid using N whenever the engine is running. Automatic transmissions have a fluid pump inside them, and usually the pump will not operate when it's in neutral. This means it can overheat if you leave it in N for extended periods of time, and you will destroy the transmission.

And yes, L is first gear.
User avatar
Andre_online
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 7730
Joined: 04 Jun 2004, 10:43
Location: Singapore (GMT+8)
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Andre_online »

Great! Thanks for the answers guys. Yea, the Land Cruiser has a separate handbrake, which my Dad engages whenever he parks. So would it harm any rear brakes or whatsortever if P is engaged, along with the application of the handbrake?

Oh, Bogan, about engaging N, since you mentioned about it, my Dad also has the habit of engaging N whenever the car is at a traffic light, or say, just a temporary stationary (i.e: traffic with slow movements). This, again, coming from a habit of using manual cars; he usually puts it to neutral to avoid the wear and tear the clutch (in our other manual car). So should I tell him to just leave it in D? Because what I know is that, in D mode, the car's hydraulic system will just keep the car moving at a slow 5-10km/h pace if your foot is off the brake pedals. What my Dad is afraid of, is that, if he didn't engage "N" in any stationary circumstances, he might be damaging the hydraulics system, or something like that. Is anyone of us right on this?

Thanks once again.
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

Andre_online wrote:So would it harm any rear brakes or whatsortever if P is engaged, along with the application of the handbrake?
No. You are supposed to use the handbrake and P together.
Andre_online wrote:Oh, Bogan, about engaging N, since you mentioned about it, my Dad also has the habit of engaging N whenever the car is at a traffic light, or say, just a temporary stationary (i.e: traffic with slow movements). This, again, coming from a habit of using manual cars; he usually puts it to neutral to avoid the wear and tear the clutch (in our other manual car). So should I tell him to just leave it in D? Because what I know is that, in D mode, the car's hydraulic system will just keep the car moving at a slow 5-10km/h pace if your foot is off the brake pedals. What my Dad is afraid of, is that, if he didn't engage "N" in any stationary circumstances, he might be damaging the hydraulics system, or something like that. Is anyone of us right on this?
In a manual car, it is correct to put the car into neutral when you are stationary. Keeping the car in gear, with your foot on the clutch, will just wear out the thrust bearing.

But with an automatic, you should definitely leave it in D. Using N for extended periods of time, especially if the car is moving, can damage the entire gearbox.
Holding your foot on the brakes does not damage or wear them in any way.

The ONLY time you should use N is if you need to push the car for some reason. Otherwise, don't use it.
User avatar
xHaZxMaTx
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 8940
Joined: 26 Jun 2005, 05:32
Location: Cali-for-ni-a

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by xHaZxMaTx »

boganbusman wrote:In a manual car, it is correct to put the car into neutral when you are stationary. Keeping the car in gear, with your foot on the clutch, will just wear out the thrust bearing.
Good to know. I'd heard this, before, but wasn't sure if it was true.
Image
User avatar
Andre_online
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 7730
Joined: 04 Jun 2004, 10:43
Location: Singapore (GMT+8)
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Andre_online »

Phew! Glad I've cleared that out. OK, I've got some explaining to do to my Dad before he sends our car for an unnecessary servicing due to his stick habits. Thank for all the answers, Ken! Really appreciate it. :)
boganbusman wrote:
Andre_online wrote:In a manual car, it is correct to put the car into neutral when you are stationary. Keeping the car in gear, with your foot on the clutch, will just wear out the thrust bearing.
I thought so too. As strange as it may seem, in Singapore, if you're taking your manual license/permit, they actually forbid you from doing this. You are, in fact, supposed to do the exact opposite: engage first gear and place your foot on the clutch pedal to get ready for the green light. Should you not follow them, your likelihood of failing just shoots up to 101%. :?

Then again, who are we to give a damn? It's their car.. :lol:
User avatar
xHaZxMaTx
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 8940
Joined: 26 Jun 2005, 05:32
Location: Cali-for-ni-a

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by xHaZxMaTx »

Not really technical questions, but they pertain to the maintenance of a car: I'm wanting to clean the interior of my car - it needs it, desperately. I've cleaned it once before, but a lot of the surfaces are plastic and have almost a leather texture, which traps dirt and is very hard to clean. There are also a lot of small nooks and crannies that are hard to clean; a wet Q-Tip just smeared the dirt around. Any suggestions? I also accidentally left the top down, the other night, in the rain, so the interior got a little damp, which I'm not terribly worried about, but I think the seats may have soaked up a lot of water. :/
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

Call a car detailer (or go there).


Next.
User avatar
ElvenAvenger
Drift King
Drift King
Posts: 999
Joined: 07 Jul 2009, 12:38

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by ElvenAvenger »

May be a stupid question, but what are actual advantages of RWD? excluding drifting related stuff.
User avatar
steelsnake00
Professional
Professional
Posts: 2136
Joined: 28 Aug 2005, 17:54
Location: Cirencester, UK

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by steelsnake00 »

ElvenAvenger wrote:May be a stupid question, but what are actual advantages of RWD? excluding drifting related stuff.
As the power is sent to the rear wheels, the front wheels only need to worry about steering and not about putting down power too. This means the car can put down power more effectively, with less interference in the way it steers or brakes. Also, RWD tends to push additional weight to the rear of the car, helping the front/rear ballance.
'01 Triumph TT600- Race spec everything
'94 Audi S2 Quattro- Road legal track project
User avatar
Carcrazy
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 4082
Joined: 28 May 2006, 05:08
Location: /// .Happy in Exile. \\\
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Carcrazy »

I might be a bit late on this, but to Bogan:

You said cars equipped with automatic transmissions shouldn't be left in neutral for extended periods of time, but I've noticed that on almost every service & installation guide I read, Toyota's said to leave the car in neutral. Seems kinda' stupid, but I'm not going to second-guess their instructions just because it seems silly IMO. Granted, the car isn't RUNNING during this period, but still.

I'm mainly referencing back to when I installed the electronics (bluetooth, iPod, etc) into my dashboard. The car actually has to be in neutral for the dash to come apart (easily, anyway,) but after that should I just shift it back to park? (The instruction guide used many diagrams, as I'm sure you've seen, so I know it was talking about an A/T.)

Also, when parking I normally come to a complete stop, shift into neutral, apply the handbrake, let off the brake pedal, and then into park. It's a habit some other Corolla owners got me into as it's supposed to reduce weight on the transmission as the cars sits idle. Whatcha' think?
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

If the car is not running then it doesn't matter what position you leave it in.
Carcrazy wrote:Also, when parking I normally come to a complete stop, shift into neutral, apply the handbrake, let off the brake pedal, and then into park. It's a habit some other Corolla owners got me into as it's supposed to reduce weight on the transmission as the cars sits idle. Whatcha' think?
In theory, makes sense. In practice, seems pointless. I've never heard of anyone breaking their transmission in P because of the weight of the car trying to turn it (unless someone hits your car whilst it's parked, or something like that).
User avatar
Carcrazy
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 4082
Joined: 28 May 2006, 05:08
Location: /// .Happy in Exile. \\\
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Carcrazy »

I don't think it would break, but for some reason on the 10th generations jerk badly when they're first put back into gear if the driver simply threw it into park rapidly after they stopped before hand. This did seem to stop it, and I mean it's always better to be safe than sorry.
Image
User avatar
xHaZxMaTx
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 8940
Joined: 26 Jun 2005, 05:32
Location: Cali-for-ni-a

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by xHaZxMaTx »

Alright, so my car started acting up, the other day - electronics were cutting in and out (radio, AC, gauges), ABS and Parking Brake lights came on and the engine would either cut in and out, as well, or not rev. Over the course of about 5 minutes, it progressively got worse until I had to stop at a gas station a few blocks from my house and once the car was off, I couldn't get it started, again; it wouldn't turn over. The car idled fine all the way to the gas station, but under what seemed like less and less power the further I drove is when it would cut out.

So I called my mom and apparently neglected to tell her that the electronics had cut out and only told her that the car wouldn't start, so when I finally got the car towed home (we tried jumping it, but even that didn't work), my mom's boyfriend thought corrosion on the battery was the problem and cleaned it. And that worked, for a day. However, on the way to work, this morning, the exact same thing started happening. Fortunately, I was able to get home, this time, but, lo and behold, I was unable to start the car, again.

I've been told the battery (~70,000 miles on the battery), the alternator or the connection to the battery is the problem. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the battery, since it's never been changed, I'm hoping it's the connection, since that would be the cheapest to replace, but it's sounding like it's the alternator, which sucks, since I just spent the rest of money on tires, yesterday and that would be the most expensive thing to replace.

I'm, like, 75% sure it's the alternator, but I'd like a second opinion. And I'd really like a second opinion that says it's not the alternator. :P
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

If you want to check the alternator, then you need to get the car started again. If there is not enough juice then I'm suprised that jump-starting didn't work. Did you use good quality jumper leads? If not then borrow some good ones, it does make a difference. Remember to clamp the negative jumper lead onto the engine, not the battery.

If it still won't start then try bypassing the starter relay by connecting the positive terminal straight to the starter motor with a heavy-guage wire. Get someone else to turn the key at the same time.

Once the car is started, use a multimeter to check the voltage across the battery terminals. It should be around 13.5v to 14.5v. If not then you probably have an alternator problem. If the charge rate is good, then remove the battery from the car. Charge the battery and take it some place that does free battery testing (most workshops or auto stores should). I'm suspecting that it will fail since 70k miles is a crapload of milage for one battery.
User avatar
viper16
Drift King
Drift King
Posts: 993
Joined: 01 Jul 2006, 02:09
Location: Aberdeen, Washington
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by viper16 »

Your cables might be corroded inside. Its very common and not that hard to fix sometimes. Usually when a terminal is corroded your cable is shot.
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

viper16 wrote:Your cables might be corroded inside. Its very common and not that hard to fix sometimes. Usually when a terminal is corroded your cable is shot.
I know it's entirely possible for the main ground and power cables to corrode inside, and it does happen, but I've never seen it personally. It would be extremely unlikely on a new-ish car, and corroded battery terminals are no indication.
User avatar
chimpzrl
Drift King
Drift King
Posts: 386
Joined: 01 Oct 2004, 16:47
Location: Radford, VA. Try and find me...

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by chimpzrl »

Ok, this one may be complicated, so hopefully I can keep the various parts organized.

First, I've heard it's best to leave a modern car in gear on hills and coasting to stops for fuel efficiency, but is this true of Automatics as well?

Also, when I drive between 25 and 30 mph I can choose either 4th or 5th gear. In 5th, it runs just below the normal idle because when I clutch in, the engine revs slightly. However, in 4th, it runs just above idle, so I just touch the gas or let it idle. Is 4th more efficient than 5th since in 5th the computer gives the engine gas to keep from stalling? Or is 5th more efficient because I don't have to give it gas at all?
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

1) This has already been covered in the last several posts.
tl;dr - With an auto tranny, don't use N unless you need to push the car.
With a manual, leaving it in gear with 0% throttle will use no petrol at all, but it puts a bit more wear and tear on the gearbox. So you can decide about that one for yourself.

2) If your car can idle smoothly in 5th gear and maintain speed at 30mph, then do that. Sounds like BS to me though
User avatar
chimpzrl
Drift King
Drift King
Posts: 386
Joined: 01 Oct 2004, 16:47
Location: Radford, VA. Try and find me...

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by chimpzrl »

boganbusman wrote: 2) If your car can idle smoothly in 5th gear and maintain speed at 30mph, then do that. Sounds like BS to me though
30 is no big deal in 5th. 1100 RPMs easy peasy. In 4th its more like 1300. 3.0L Yamaha V6 ftw (/fanboy).

P.S.: By idle, I mean with no input from me. That's maybe 1100 to 1200 RPMs in gear or 800 to 900 when stationary.
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

Yamaha V6 . . . you have an SHO? lol

Just try driving it one way or the other for a long period of time and see which method nets the best fuel economy. Basiclally, it's the sort of thing that you need to work out on your own.
Without understanding how the ECU on your particular engine works, I can't really say which way is better.
User avatar
Carcrazy
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 4082
Joined: 28 May 2006, 05:08
Location: /// .Happy in Exile. \\\
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by Carcrazy »

Yo Bogan, I gots a question for ya'... or anyone else who feels like answering. =P

With the purchase of the S13 this probably won't happen, but eh you never know. I've got one last round of parts I'm planning to buy for the 'rolla before I leave it alone to get ragged on during its DD duty.

Anywho, I held off on buying a pulley set (crank pulley, mainly) because I've heard mixed reviews on their reliability and wasn't sure it was worth the 5hp I might gain.

On the other hand, I've read online that most I4 crank pulleys don't even have a harmonic balancer, which would basically make the aftermarket version the exact same; albeit smaller and lighter, obviously. So what's your take - should I just leave it alone and sink my $150 into, say, a new (un-rusted) trunk lid for the Nissan, or would it be a decent investment for some MPG's and a few giggles?

Thanks bro. :D
Image
User avatar
boganbusman
Unbeatable
Unbeatable
Posts: 5142
Joined: 03 Sep 2004, 12:09
Location: Mute City
Contact:

Re: TECH TALK - ask your technical car questions

Post by boganbusman »

Carcrazy wrote:Anywho, I held off on buying a pulley set (crank pulley, mainly) because I've heard mixed reviews on their reliability and wasn't sure it was worth the 5hp I might gain.
A replacement pulley will only gain HP if it's an underdrive pulley.
And an underdrive pulley is a very bad idea on a street car. They are for race cars only.
Carcrazy wrote:On the other hand, I've read online that most I4 crank pulleys don't even have a harmonic balancer
lolwut

Almost all engines have one, regardless of the engine configuration.
Carcrazy wrote:should I just leave it alone
YES
Post Reply

Return to “The Cars”