TC 2 - may be some things to consider

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 25 Jun 2004, 12:36

I don't know, i posted this in other thread, but may be better to leave it on its own.

IMHO,

For the next comp when you guys run it,
Make only 1 car per user to submit - decrease the number of submissions and your own time spent on uploading cars. That in turn will help us, the participants - we won't have to spend hours on voting tours. If you also have the judges panel select the cars that actually get to be presented to the voting public - that would be better - at least no more pink Neon, and cyan wheels with a christams selection of vinyls piled on top of each other. GT and bobyx are all good car designers in NFSU and their selections would surely increase the quality. Now we have even less entries!

We currently got like 3000 or smth cars in total - so we'd be down to may be 200 but really, those will be the better cars. There would be only 1 voting tour to take - all be it a long one, but it's possible with Nissan Skyline @ 190 right now. You'd improve the quality of the competition, and still will have a lot of potential winners. You'd only have 1 voting tour to thoroughly check for downvoting (instead of 20), and you could make the comp run with voting for ... 5 days, and than spend 3 days on sorting through the votes and making sure all is fair, no double users, upvoting and so on.

Than you publish the results - top 10 and then you can pick the winners - either yourselves or go with what the users liked (if there is a strong candidate for example).

Oh, and please take it as suggestion, this is just my opinion.

Post by **Bojan** » 25 Jun 2004, 13:05

Considering TC was the first competition we ever organized, it went through quite good. With the experience we got from TC, I'm sure TC2 will be more user friendly, especially with the duration of the competition.

I can tell you now that the first part of the competition will last no more than 10 days with no more than 100 contestants per day. 24 hour voting tours will probably stay, as it proved to be quite nice for some people to get a wallpaper at the end.

The current per car competing is completely out of the question because of the 30 cars in NFSU2. TC2 will be mixed (no more car specific).

About the 1 car per user submission: we'll see about that. It really depends on the number of people visiting the website at that time.

Oh and don't expect TC2 at least untill a couple of months after the release of NFSU2. We won't start organizing untill we see the game.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 25 Jun 2004, 13:08

I totally agree with UrQuattro. One day to vote more than 100 cars is to small, and mainly when you see unique vinyls or horrors like this... A selection more difficult to participate, more days to vote (1 week ?), one car per user and 20 winners to the semi-finals : would be perfect.

sorry for my english

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 25 Jun 2004, 13:14

I agree that had the previous comps a-la GT weren't run - this could have been much much worse. So TC2 will surely be a huge improvement. The real challenge is to design a voting systmem that doesn't punish you so much!

And I think you got nothing to worry about when talking about the traffic when it comes ot first months of NFSU2, since even now, when NFSu is pretty much dead, things are very well overall.

Glad that the specific car idea is going away as well as the 20 day voting period.

You have to make mistakes to succeed!

Post by **TheStig** » 25 Jun 2004, 14:28

you both got some good points there Urq and Bob...

and the judging panel isn't a bad Idea IMO....

and I think we still can learn something from GT's challenges....

like the challenges itself: Pink, Rally etc...

the cars in these challenges had nice cars and all had one think in common... wich made voting more fun..

the TC had some cool cars but most was..... well you know, same goes for the winners.... almost every time I seen better....

but that's just me...

but for the first real Challenge you did pretty great BOB
think everybody noticed the low amouth of votes... and high amouth of cars... does not compute IMO... maybe thinks to think about in the next edition

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 25 Jun 2004, 15:07

OK, Im sorry because TC results so now I tell my ideas for TC2. I agree with Urq, he said interesting things.

-> TC2 for Nfsu2. Agree, we are tired of nfsu1.

-> 1car per user. It is an excellent idea. I uploaded 19cars (all except Lancer) and honestly, only about 5 of them were really good. I made the others to get more possibilities to win, not because they were really good cars.

-> Staff members. I think staff could participate, they are good making cars for example GT. If they win, it wont be suspicious. They organizate the Challenge seriously, and Im sure they dont manipulate results. But you decide.

-> Voting system (Downvoting/upvoting) Remove this problem is the real challenge. Lets purpose some things: According to Urq idea, there will be about 200-400 cars, not 3000. So I think it could be a week for first voting tour, and then 2 or 3days more to semi-finals/final. Another idea: I think users must vote the whole list of cars. If you dont complete the voting tour, your votes wont be accepted. Ok, you have to vote the whole list, for example 260cars. The next thing is to regulate the average votes of each person. for example, the average rates you make must be between 4-7 points. But I know it is difficult to know when something is voting up or down.

-> Pics display. It is an important thing, you could win or lose points due to this simple thing. IMO it is good that principal pic was in garage. In addition, nfsu2 will offer authentic garages and screenshots will be too much brightened/clear/attractive than that dirty/ugly tunnel. But 2nd and 3rd pic must be showed in bigger sizes. In TC they are at 150x112. I suggest 240x180 size. It is cool and proportional. In rebate of space, you could show 1st pic smaller (400x300), not 468x351 like now. Images lose quality because pixels are not proportional. I dont know how to say it better... sorry.

Nothing more

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 25 Jun 2004, 15:22

Bobyx, this is an idea you'd like:

Split the tours into a batches of say, 50 cars. So 200 cars - 4 tours. Now the part you might think good - at the end of each tour - give a wallpaper or smth. That way you get more wallpapers, and more insentive to go on.

Post by **Bojan** » 25 Jun 2004, 16:20

I was thinking of using the same system as now, only 100 cars per day (which is easy to rate). That way we could squeeze in 1000 entries without a problem and the whole competition would be long enough and on the other side still interesting to vote on.
But I can't really say how TC2 will look like... It's still a long way untill NFSU2...

Staff will never participate in any competition with prizes.

About pics display... It's pointless to have so many large pics. You can enlarge them anyway.

We'll see about that judge panel... It really depends on how many cars per user will be accepted. If only 1, then it won't be needed.

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 26 Jun 2004, 22:51

Today I have voted in Semi Finals, and I have to say it was so relaxing. 40cars is perfect, I voted them quickly. 100 is still too many cars and too much time.

With 200 users uploading cars, and 10days of competition, it would be perfect to accept 2cars per user. In this situation, we will vote around 40 each day during 10days. Then, semifinals with 60cars (30x2) and the final like in TC1.

Taking this system, you could choose your 2prefered cars and make it perfect. In addition I am challenge cars quality will grow. Why? Because you only tune the cars you really like. For example, I like to make 350Zs and 206 so I made great Zs and 206s. Another guy who dont like them, wiill make them ugly. IMO this is the reason for poor quality cars in TC. I hate Lancer, Skyline, Supra... and I am not able to pull of a good looking car with them.

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 26 Jun 2004, 22:56

I think even though it's too early to predict, bobyx seems to have made up his mind - like he said above, having each user submit every car is going to be unlikely. So that's all set!

ZeroB@NG · Post by **ZeroB@NG** » 27 Jun 2004, 12:28

I agree with Dani, when you didn't vote the hole comp it should not be accepted! If you have voted on the same IP like an other User in +/- 24hours the second votes should not be accepted

When its mixed because of the 30 cars in NFSU then i would say 1 Car per user. -> the hole thing could be handled in one day... but a comp over one day is too fast and won't be recognized by much voters so 1 Week would be good.

If you decide again to do a 1 car each day Comp... then i would say at least 5 Cars per User... 1 or 2 are not enough imho

Unique Vinyls shouldn't be accepted (if they are accepted they get downvoted anyway)

just my 2Euro cent

PowerSandro · Post by **PowerSandro** » 28 Jun 2004, 11:51

(I had posted something like this in other forum...)
I think is good to users only has possible to vote in 25% or 30% of cars, it will be more people votating cause is easier to gain the wallpapers, and less downvoters cause they downvote don't affect all other cars! And in this way is possible to accept more cars per user, like 3 or 4 (but I liked to the idea with less cars per user, but only one is a little bit drastic!). AND MAKE VISIBLE USER VOTES, LIKE IN SHOWROOM!

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 28 Jun 2004, 12:07

Yeah, visible user votes. Could you give me an example of car in Showroom with higher guest rating than user rating?? lol
Maybe those cars with only 2 or 3 votes.

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 28 Jun 2004, 12:13

I think that we tried both systems - visible and invisible and it's ok when it's invisible, at least there won't be "why the hell you didn't give me 10pts" or whatever. This way when next comp comes, people won't be on revenge and just downvote those who thought their cars were bad. That's the whole reason for closed vote. If you don't know what other person gave you, you judge his/her car more honestly, wouldn't you agree? So it's better this way, even though downvoting still there. If more people would vote on what they think about the car - not just about the person - it's better.

And I like the idea of 1 or 2 cars - making more is time consuming, and dilutes the quality. You will see a lot of similar cars, and that's a bit boring.

PowerSandro · Post by **PowerSandro** » 28 Jun 2004, 12:40

yeah the revenge... right UrQuattro... but if put only in game pictures to vote? only see the garage picture after you vote to see the user and player name in game! it will be realy dificult to know who downvote your car! Or other idea, only votes is visible to all users except for the owner of the car, so we know exactly who downvote because if you find 4 or 5 downvotes for the same person it's ok, but if you find 40 or 50 downvotes it's something wrong, no? and you don't need to see your votes to see who are the downvotes... (but I realy prefer my first idea, only in game pictures to vote)...

UrQuattro · Post by **UrQuattro** » 28 Jun 2004, 12:55

The way it is with closed voting is fine - you don't know who wins - and neither do the downvoters. So it excludes voting based on other people's votes. That's good. ANd downvoters no longer can just trash certain cars - they are forced to give more 1's to vote more cars down - and therefore are easier to spot out and eliminate.

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 28 Jun 2004, 12:57

I disagree with your 2 ideas Power... sorry

--> 1st: Showing only Ingame is not justice. Because there are ppl with 3ghz and Gforce FX6800 and other players with a little Gforce 2 like me, without motion blur and this. Im going to buy a new PC but it is still no justice. But dont worry, TC2 is for Nfsu2, where garage pics dont show your profile name (supossedly)

-->2nd: Staff (bobyx) already knows the votes of ppl, and notice when someone is downvoting.

Post by **TheStig** » 28 Jun 2004, 14:41

I think next time we should not be able to see the creators name on the garage shot.... it still does tend to manipulate votings....
many users including me used the same name and their own name during the TC so when voting you where able to see who made it... and I know I got one person who gave me a low rating because I commented on his car and said it needed more... (CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM)....

maybe things to think about...

cheers

PowerSandro · Post by **PowerSandro** » 28 Jun 2004, 14:50

is possible to see the player name in nfsu2... look in the garage screenshot, the more yellow/brow one, not the white...

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 29 Jun 2004, 18:00

Yeah, in this garage name is shown. But no in Paint garage!

PowerSandro · Post by **PowerSandro** » 29 Jun 2004, 18:17

no, in the white one not shows... but... you know, is hard to make all users take pictures only in this one?

drive2droad · Post by **drive2droad** » 01 Jul 2004, 14:53

2 many entries also bore pplz like me

Supra-man · Post by **Supra-man** » 01 Jul 2004, 16:54

even though tc2 is sooo far away i think its good to start preparing ahead of time, and many of these ideas i like and think should be considered in tc2.

^Sparco^ · Post by **^Sparco^** » 01 Jul 2004, 17:01

And we can't celebrate it in November... time needed to pass the game! lol I know some guys complete the game in 2days but I need a month. Im not a bad player, but I usually do 5-6races per day. In other way, I dont enjoy the game! So we must wait until December or so. Now, practice buiding cars in nfsu1

Supra-man · Post by **Supra-man** » 01 Jul 2004, 17:33

yeah, i agree dani, but surley plan ahead to have a great tc2. i just cant stand that its still 5 months away till it comes out, talk about what seems to be forever!!!