European Cars -- IMPORTANT DEBATE

Glopaticki · Post by **Glopaticki** » 14 Jun 2007, 00:36

Japs kill whales not you, blame the Japanese Al not us!

Post by **TheStig** » 16 Jun 2007, 00:00

Alot of the city where I live (and many other cities in The Netherlands) have 30khm zones (20mph) in areas where people live (even the connecting roads) they are changed from 50 kmh to 30 to be better for the enviroment and safety. the enviromental point is pure BS cause every body runs in 2nd gear and lets say 2500 rpm while 50 in 3rd or even 4th will have a lower rpm (when I drive 50 kmh in 4th I'm running at 1300 orso and according to the computer use almost no fuel.
I in general ignore the 30 kmh signs cause they only annoy me. unless the road does not allow it (the area where I live has alot of corners in the streets and even the connecting roads are full of them and to drive 50 there wasn't even a good Idea before they made it 30. it was simply not comfortable doing 50 there.

Koenigsegg_Rox · Post by **Koenigsegg_Rox** » 17 Jun 2007, 02:06

darknight788 wrote:well alot of them are already limited to 155 mph, they really shouldnt worry though as alot of handheld tuners allow you to remove the speed and or rev limiter

All German production cars (eg. Mercedes-Benz, Audi, BMW, etc.) have been limited to 155mph. There are a couple of exceptions, mainly top end Porsches though.

darknight788 · Post by **darknight788** » 17 Jun 2007, 07:41

yea most normal mercedes have been regulated to 155 along with most other euro cars. only a few have been set free

Koenigsegg_Rox · Post by **Koenigsegg_Rox** » 17 Jun 2007, 08:25

In other words, supercars.

steelsnake00 · Post by **steelsnake00** » 17 Jun 2007, 13:28

Koenigsegg_Rox wrote:
darknight788 wrote:well alot of them are already limited to 155 mph, they really shouldnt worry though as alot of handheld tuners allow you to remove the speed and or rev limiter
All German production cars (eg. Mercedes-Benz, Audi, BMW, etc.) have been limited to 155mph. There are a couple of exceptions, mainly top end Porsches though.

Audi R8 and Mercedes McLaren SLR as well.

DarrenR21373 · Post by **DarrenR21373** » 22 Jun 2007, 19:44

The McLaren SLR is built in Woking, Surrey at McLaren's Technology Centre.

I guess this would in effect make it a British car? Hence not limited to 155

Koenigsegg_Rox · Post by **Koenigsegg_Rox** » 23 Jun 2007, 01:55

Not necessarily, there was probably too much power and torque to limit the car to 155mph, so they may have removed the limiter because of that.

steelsnake00 · Post by **steelsnake00** » 23 Jun 2007, 12:12

Koenigsegg_Rox wrote:Not necessarily, there was probably too much power and torque to limit the car to 155mph, so they may have removed the limiter because of that.

If you can limit a 507bhp M5 to 155, theres no reason you couldn't an SLR.

Post by **TheStig** » 23 Jun 2007, 13:11

You can limit everything if you want, it's all electronic so a speedlimiter is nothing more then a electronical block for more fuel in the engine so it doesn't go any faster.
You can have as much power as you want from a engine but when you limit the fuel to the engine the car doesn't go any faster.

GLoPJe · Post by **GLoPJe** » 24 Jun 2007, 13:28

this idea sucks it would not help at all
i think it would more help to get trucks and the big s u v s of the road

Koenigsegg_Rox · Post by **Koenigsegg_Rox** » 25 Jun 2007, 00:09

TheStig wrote:You can limit everything if you want, it's all electronic so a speedlimiter is nothing more then a electronical block for more fuel in the engine so it doesn't go any faster.
You can have as much power as you want from a engine but when you limit the fuel to the engine the car doesn't go any faster.

Quite true, considering that the Bugatti Veyron is supposedly limeted to 407kph/approximately 250mph.

And the Ford GT is limited to 330k/205mph

darknight788 · Post by **darknight788** » 25 Jun 2007, 01:47

is the bugatti electronically limited or drag limited ?

Post by **TheStig** » 25 Jun 2007, 02:02

I really doubt the Veyron is limited by electronics cause no car in the range is limited at all. and it would be totally useless to limit something at 407 kmh. 407 is most likely just the topspeed it did on the VW testtrack.

The only thing that limits the car is the fact that it will run out of fuel in 10 minutes (and in 15 minutes (orso) it will ruin out of the grip of it's tires)

steelsnake00 · Post by **steelsnake00** » 25 Jun 2007, 10:51

The Veyron is limited by it's aerodynamics, drag co-efficient and BHP. With 1001bhp and it's drag co-efficient it's acceleration force and drag match at about 265mph. It's just it would take a very, very, very long time to get it up to that kind of speed, as the exceleration from about 230+ would be rather slow.

darknight788 · Post by **darknight788** » 25 Jun 2007, 23:09

stig's got a good point, its not like it would help in a crash or make it any safer. 265 mph seems reasonable for the veyron but it i dont know what kind of accel. it has around 230 mph ... it might run out of fuel before it hits 265. btw what kind of tires is it using ?

boganbusman · Post by **boganbusman** » 25 Jun 2007, 23:36

Michelin PAX, which will last for about 15 minutes at top speed. Dunno what size they are . . . it would be something ridiculous

PSZeTa · Post by **PSZeTa** » 25 Jun 2007, 23:37

Wiki says that the Veyron is electronically limited to 253mph, while the theoretical top speed is 257mph.

James May says: "the tires will only last for about fifteen minutes, but it's OK because the fuel runs out in twelve."

HowStuffWorks:

''Even the tires for the Veyron are unique. They're specially designed by Michelin to handle the stress of driving at 250 mph. The tires need to be sticky like a race car's and able to handle 1.3 G's on the skidpad. However, they also need to last longer than the 70 or so miles of a typical race tire.

Michelin therefore created completely new tires to handle the Veyron's unique requirements. In the rear, the tires are 14.4 inches (36.6 cm) wide. Specifically, the tires measure 245/690 R 520 A front and 365/710 R 540 A rear, where 245 and 365 are the width in millimeters (9.5 and 14.4 inches respectively). The rims are 520 mm and 540 mm in diameter (approximately 20 inches). These tires, in other words, are massive -- the rears are the widest ever produced for a passenger car.

The tires use the Michelin PAX system. Their pressure is monitored automatically, and they can run flat for approximately 125 miles (201 km) at 50 mph (80 kph). According to Michelin, the run-flat detection system "plays an integral role in active safety in PAX System. Its role is to inform you of a loss of pressure, either gradual or sudden." Once warned of an air leak by the PAX system, you can reduce your speed and head toward a tire repair center.

One advantage of the PAX system and its run-flat ability is that it eliminates the need for a spare tire.''

Koenigsegg_Rox · Post by **Koenigsegg_Rox** » 26 Jun 2007, 08:22

darknight788 wrote:stig's got a good point, its not like it would help in a crash or make it any safer. 265 mph seems reasonable for the veyron but it i dont know what kind of accel. it has around 230 mph ... it might run out of fuel before it hits 265. btw what kind of tires is it using ?

Apparently it can reach top speed in 30-40 secs.

darknight788 · Post by **darknight788** » 26 Jun 2007, 21:59

damn, so it can reach 253 mph in 30-40 seconds, not too bad

PSZeTa · Post by **PSZeTa** » 26 Jun 2007, 22:03

And Wiki says..:

Zero to 60 mph (97 km/h): 2.5 s
Zero to 100 mph (161 km/h): 5.5 s
Zero to 150 mph (241 km/h): 9.8 s
Zero to 200 mph (322 km/h): 19.5 s
Zero to 250 mph (402 km/h): 55 s

:p

Striker94 · Post by **Striker94** » 20 Feb 2008, 12:23

HEY!

how the **** did we manage to spend a whole page on Bugatti Veyrons and bloody tyres???

You know, if you are moving at 150m/h, you will burn less fuel (hence cause less pollution)than the same car moving at 50m/h over the same distance.

I have a feeling that the only 'everyday' supercar would have to be a porsche Carrera 4S. And there isn't any unrestricted roads in Australia anymore!

The last ones were in central NT and now have 11 km/h speed limits imposed. (like there's any speed cameras...)

Post by **TheStig** » 20 Feb 2008, 18:37

Mate, you clearly have no clue on how the fuel use of a car works.
just because a car doing 200 is theoreticly 2 times as fast at it's destination does not mean it uses less fuel just because instead of doing a distance in 10 minutes instead of 20 (all theoreticly because your never exactly 2 times as fast)
And even tough a slower car taking 10 minutes more (when the other is already standing still) the fast car still has used far more fuel then the one driving half the speed.
It simply doesn't work like that.
it's not even close to that cause it's the other way around, the fast you go the more fuel you use every km/mile (not in minutes, cause timewise you will use even more fuel when going fast.)

lets take the Veyron again for example.
Like said it runs out of fuel in 12 minutes at top speed (take 400 kmh (240mph) for easy calculating) wich in your system would mean it could not even run for 48 minutes at 100 kmh (60 mph) wich ofcourse is not true at 100 kmh it can run for much much longer then 1 hour.

If driving faster would make the driving more economical and enviromentally friendly then they would instantly increase the max speeds on highways....

xHaZxMaTx · Post by **xHaZxMaTx** » 20 Feb 2008, 21:43

Fuel consumption at high speeds has mostly to do with wind resistance, doesn't it? I mean, let's say a car can travel 20 M.P.H. in 2nd gear at 3,000 R.P.M., but it can also travel at 50 M.P.H. in 4th gear, at the same R.P.M. Theoretically, the car would use the same amount of fuel in both situations (not factoring wind resistance), because at both speeds, the engine is turning over the same number of times per minute, right? It's only when the car is moving faster, thus creating more wind resistance, that it has to push harder and use more fuel. At slower speeds (under 80 M.P.H.), it probably wouldn't make much of a difference, but at over 200 M.P.H., the amount of force pushing back against your car in wind resistance is immense.

baumaxx1 · Post by **baumaxx1** » 21 Feb 2008, 00:21

Umm.... smart cars and priuses have higher top speeds... surely it won't happen as it'll kill close to all of Europe's car industry. Almost every modern car is capable of 200km/h (101mph=161km/h or something like that). Cows make more greenhouse gas emissions then a Zonda... And also, this will be unfair to those who like to take their car out on the track...
If they're serious about saving the environment, why don't they find a good fuel replacement instead of stuffing everyone around?

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European Cars -- IMPORTANT DEBATE

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